Interviewee: Dr.Claudie J. Mackey, 71 years old

Interviewer: Breana Wynn

Place of Interview: Willie and Jacqueline Gilchrest Education and Psychology Building, Elizabeth City State University, Elizabeth City, NC

Date and Time: April 17, 2014 at 1:30 pm

Description: Claudie Mackey is a 71 year old man from Engelhard, North Carolina which is located out on the coast about 100 miles away from Elizabeth City, North Carolina. He grew up in a Christian based family. His parents instilled in him at an early age the rules of fairness and equality. He also learned at an early age that African Americans were treated differently than whites but he lived in a community where there were whites that treated him equally. Although he knew that African Americans got treated differently he still did not have a full understanding of why African Americans and whites were not treated the same or why whites had privileges that African Americans did not have. Once he got older he made a more distinct separation of the different races.

He noticed that the white kids rode the bus to school and the African Americans walked to school, all of the textbooks that were used in his school were used and had names of the students from the white schools on located in them that are what clearly made him understand the separation. Because his parents were a part of the civil rights movement, they made certain provisions for him so there were days that he was able to actually ride the bus to and from school. Even though he rode the bus, he still dealt with the segregation at the bus station where the blacks went to one and the whites went to the other, along with them having to use two separate bathrooms.

Mackey’s parents Christian beliefs his family was very much so involved in the civil rights movement in his county, Hyde County. Mackey remembers his mother going to civil rights meetings when he was a child. His mother not only attended meetings but she somewhat held a leadership role in these meetings. He came to Elizabeth City State Teacher’s College (Now Elizabeth City State University) as a freshman in 1961 and completed his education in 1965. Mackey never stepped into a gymnasium until 1965 when he signed a contract with the Dallas Cowboys. After he signed with the Dallas Cowboys even the whites in his county that did treat him poorly began to treat him better. Dr. Mackey had a very promising career in athletics, but could not fulfill his practicing because there was not a gymnasium located in the African American schools only in the white schools. In Dr. Mackey’s earlier years he tried to make a career of playing with the Dallas Cowboys. After his football career plummeted he migrated to New York City where he began his career as an educator. After twelve years of educating in New York City, he returned to Elizabeth City where he continued in the teaching field where he still remains today.

Transcript:

Wynn: How was it growing up during this time?

Dr. Mackey: During this time I remember having to order my food through a window while the whites sat on the inside and ate. If it was pouring down raining, I had to wait for my food in the rain or not get anything to eat. I initially grew up not completely understanding segregation but later had to deal with it hands on.

Wynn: Were you ever involved in the civil rights movement?

Dr. Mackey: Yes, there was actually a protest here in Elizabeth City. We often give credit to North Carolina A & T for staging the first protest movement but when you study the daily advance and early printings you will notice that Elizabeth city had a protest but it did not catch fire like A & T did. Students at Elizabeth City wanted to have equal access so as a student in the midst of the Vietnam War, you know I was a student and in the protest movement I marched. I recall one day leaving school with a group of students in the form of a protest and we were walking down Southern avenue and we were going to a sit in at the movie house. We even protested on campus, we didn’t like the way the food was being prepared. The early 60’s was a moment of protest and when students reached a point where they didn’t like what was going on they would collectively voice their opinions and usually it was in form of a sit-in or rebellious group meeting. The mind state of the students was if we stuck together we could bring about change.

Wynn: How were your educational experiences?

Dr. Mackey: Well overall I enjoyed it. I can remember getting dinner and it would be a sandwich, a piece of fruit, and milk. The young ladies could not wear pants they were only allowed to wear skirts. The only time they could wear skirts was on Saturday morning when they were cleaning their rooms. Now you see the parking lots full of vehicles driven by the students but then it may have been ne car in the parking lot. Young ladies as a freshman had to be in their dorms by 6, sophomore by 7, Junior 8, and as a senior at 9. That was a period in time where I think back what would happen if we tried to do that today.

Wynn: Have you ever had any first-hand experience with racism?

Dr. Mackey: Yes, when we protested in Elizabeth City, as we got half-way down the street a car rode by and threw hot urine on us. Some of us wanted to retaliate but out mentor would not allow us to put ourselves in that situation.

Wynn: What are some things that you would like to see done in the near future?

Dr. Mackey: I would like to see students care more about their education. Growing up things were hard to come by so we took education very seriously because we wanted to go further in life I think now students don’t have as much of a struggle like I did so they take education for granted. I see students slacking off, not coming to class, and not completing assignment. There is so much opportunity and students now will not be able to take full advantage of it because they are trying their best at achieving.

Wynn: Did you ever think that you would see some of the things that are happening today? (I.e. having a black president)

Dr. Mackey: I thought there would be a day where there would be a black president, but, I did not think that I would be here to see it. If you are a believer of what’s in the bible it was to occur. I believe we are also going to see a woman as president.

Bibliography

Highland, Jim, and McDougall, Harold. Student Handbook: The Struggle for Civil Rights: “Reacting to the Past” Game Development. 2010

Theoharis, Jeanne, and Woodard, Komozi. Freedom North: Black Freedom Struggles Outside the South. New York: Palgrave Macmillan. 2003.